Have you ever wondered about the differences between playing chess online and over-the-board? How does it impact your strategies and even your enjoyment of the game? Welcome to the first solo episode of the fifth season of The Chess Angle. We're making our podcast experience more user-friendly by introducing chapter markers and experimenting with video versions of our interview episodes on YouTube. This week, Neal dives into the mailbag to answer your questions.
In a light-hearted discussion, we compare online chess to the more traditional OTB format. We explore whether using a physical chessboard while playing online can help you practice for real-life tournaments, yet we also emphasize that nothing can truly replicate the thrill of a live game. Neal shares a personal strategy he uses when he's overlooked a crucial move in an OTB game. We even discuss the Intercontinental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) variation!
00:00 - Intro.
00:35 - Opening Remarks/Video versions
05:34 - Listener Mailbag Intro.
07:01 - Online Chess with Physical Board
12:56 - OTB Time Controls
18:29 - Move-by-Move Books
24:40 - World Champ. Format Suggestions
28:18 - English Opening
32:50 - ICBM Variation
35:36 - Outro.
The Amazon links above are affiliate links which earn us a small commission on qualifying purchases. This helps support the podcast at no additional cost to you.
If you have a question or topic idea for a future episode, e-mail us at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Welcome to the chess angle. This is not your typical chess podcast. If you're an amateur or club level player, the chess angle is for you. Our content is aimed at busy adults who are serious about the game but have limited study time. Featured guests include both amateur and title players alike. And now here's your host Feature of the Long Island chess club, ...Neal:
Welcome everyone. This is my first solo episode of the season. I know I ended season four rather abruptly. I kind of snuck out the back door. It was like I flipped the switch. Basically, june was crazy. I'm not going to bore you with details, but it was a life happens thing. As much as I enjoy this podcast and talking about the game, this is a side hustle. I'm not a full time content creator or projecting myself as such. As with all of you, I do have a career in responsibilities and goals outside of playing chess. So I just needed to step away for a month. But I'm back Now. Next thing just some sort of housekeeping and programming notes. For the audio version, I am adding chapter markers or clickable timestamps, which is a nice feature. This way you can jump ahead to sections you want to hear. Or maybe, if you're listening in the car or while you're walking the dog, let's say there's a section oh, that's interesting, I want to go back. You can easily find it Now with the chapter markers, because I'm just kind of experimenting. I'm just getting into it. It definitely works in the Spotify app, not the desktop application or like the Spotify website, but if you're on the Spotify app on your phone or tablet, which is probably many of you. It should work. And it also works on our website, thechessanglecom. You'll see a tab for it. I'm not sure about Apple podcasts. I'm actually not an Apple person. I don't have an iPhone, I'm not really into Apple products. That's a separate discussion. But anyway, I'm an Android person, so I'm not sure if it's working. The chapter markers on Apple podcasts You'll have to let me know. One thing I noticed when I first dropped the episode, because you know I dropped my episodes on Sundays. I have it auto set to release at 4 am Eastern time on Sunday mornings, but for some reason the chapter markers take a day or two to post. I guess they need to calibrate it, I'm not sure. So when the episode first drops, the chapter markers will look as just text with not any clickable links, and then, after a day or two, you'll have clickable timestamps, but you'll see it as plain text as well. See, what I do is I type it in the show notes. They convert it to clickable links, but the original text still stays there. Anyway, like I said, this is in beta, so to speak. I'm playing around with it, but the chapter markers for the first two episodes of this season, and this one, this episode as well, should be working All right, so that's kind of a cool feature. Next thing our YouTube channel. I am experimenting with video versions for our interview episodes Now. There's two on there now the James Altucher episode and the Gerald Times episode Both great. Definitely check them out. I'm going to see how this goes. I'm still playing around with how the YouTube channel is going to look. As far as the video presentations, I'm not sure if I'm going to stick with posting full episodes or maybe I'll do clips like 10 minute clips, whatever, because people really aren't looking at the entire hour or 15 minutes. I mean, it really is an audio, an aural A-U-R-A-L type of content. These are really meant to be listened to. The main reason I have the YouTube channel is really to direct traffic to the audio version right on Spotify or Apple podcasts. That's really the type of content that this is, but I guess some people do like to look at the video version. But, like I said, I'm deciding whether I'm going to keep full episodes or just 10 minute clips, and I'm looking into maybe doing chapter markers on there as well. I got to see, because I don't want this to turn into like a whole another thing, because it's another sort of workflow thing. Now I will tell you this the videos on the YouTube channel really aren't edited like the audio version, because what I do the platform I use to record I pretty much just put the video right onto YouTube. I'll chop maybe the beginning and the end where we kind of talk off air, but then I just kind of put it on there, because I'm not going to sit there and start editing the video version. That's just going to be way too much work. So it's not going to have the same sort of tight editing that the audio version does, but it is kind of cool to see it right. You can see my mug, you can see the guest. So, like I said, I'm going to play around with what the channel is ultimately going to look like as far as the video presentation. But that's a cool addition to the podcast and I'm happy to add it. So this week I want to catch up on our listener mailbag. I apologize that I'm just getting to these now, but better late than never, as they say. A reminder everyone is invited to email questions or topic ideas. It lets me know what you find relevant. It helps me map out content for the show and it gives you a chance as a listener to have a voice. If you're listening to the podcast and you're enjoying it, you certainly can email me any questions or suggestions that you have. The email address is info at thechessanglecom. You can also hit me up on Twitter at the Chess Angle. I'm not a big Twitter or a social media person. As I'm getting older, I'm getting social media fatigue. I can't go on Twitter for more than like five minutes. So for the podcast I use it to announce upcoming episodes, or I usually post it once it dropped, like here's a new episode, type of thing. But if you want to message me on Twitter, you can certainly do that. Now I can't promise your submission will be used on the show, but of course I will read everything that comes my way. So here we go.Narrator:
You've got mail.Neal:
Alright, so here we go. We're going to keep this light. This is going to be the chess angle light. We're going to hang out, we're going to chill. This is going to be kind of a mellow episode. I don't know, I'm in a mellow mood today. Anyway, our first message or email is from Matteo and he writes Hi, neil wanted to say I am loving your podcast. I'm a learning adult with limited time and just love the game I played when I was little and just got back into it, maybe three to five months ago. I purchased the amateur's mind and I'm a quarter of the way through and, wow, great recommendation. I travel a lot for work so it's very hard for me to join the local chess club tournaments as I can't commit to the six plus weeks looking for other options. But I'm very excited to join my first OTB 20. As I am looking for options, I purchased the square off pro chess board and in playing on chesscom but over the board, just to get a feel for the pieces and the board. The board is also tournament size and I'm loving it. However, I have been playing 15 10 games, as anything longer is very hard to find people to play. I was wondering what you think about playing over the board but online. Hopefully it will get me somewhat ready for a live tournament. All right, thanks, matteo, both for your email and the kind words about the podcast. I really appreciate it. So a couple of things to unpack there. First of all, yes, the amateurs mind very, very important book I'm glad you're reading and I've mentioned this before. For any adult beginner or adult improver looking to get better, if they haven't read that book, I don't consider them to be a serious improver. That's how important that book is. So I'm glad you're reading it. You know, I tell everybody like that's the book to read. It's a popular book and people like it and it's gotten praise. I'm just surprised that book isn't considered as iconic as I think it is. Obviously that's my own opinion of my own bias, but the amateurs mind by. I am Jeremy Selman. I'll put a link in the show notes for anyone who's interested. Such an important book. So I'm glad you're reading that. Now I understand about you having difficulty committing to tournaments. It is difficult for a lot of people because of work schedules. Playing an over the board tournament player is a commitment. Now, as far as what I believe you're doing is, you're playing your games online but you're using an actual physical board. So you have the board set up next to your computer. You know you're playing the game online, quote unquote, but you're actually moving the pieces and looking at everything on a physical board. I think that's great. A lot of people do that. A lot of people do that to play like you are, and they'll also do that for their chest study, for their puzzles and things. Rather than use a computer, which is kind of like a 2D thing, they want an actual physical board and they'll set up their puzzles and they'll review their games that way, on an actual board, to try to emulate tournament conditions as much as possible. Now, to answer your question, it'll help. It's not the same as actually playing in a live tournament. I mean, when you're in a live tournament, you're sitting across another person, which is a different experience. Now, what you're doing will help somewhat, but I'm going to be honest, it's not quite the same as actually going to an over the board tournament and playing someone live. But I think it's a good start until your schedule changes to the point where you'll be able to participate over the board. So, yeah, it's totally fine. I think it'll help, but again, it's not going to be quite a complete substitute for playing someone live. Now something else that I'll just add, because I do this myself if I made a very bad move, or not so much a blunder, but if I just made a move where I missed, I played an okay move but I missed something that I should have seen. What I'll actually do is, because I normally go over my games on the computer, I'll actually set it up on a physical board because I try to see it that way, the way I did at the club, and I try to get into my thought process like why did I make that move? Why didn't I see that With my experience and my abilities and everything I've studied, this is a move I should have seen. Obviously there are things that I missed, where I wouldn't expect myself to have seen it, where I won't beat myself up, where I'll say you know what, that was difficult to see. Even a 2300 player might have had difficulty with that. But if I missed a move, I should say if I missed a move, that is that I really felt I should have seen. I'll set it up on a physical board rather than look at the game on the computer and I'll try to figure out. Okay, like, why did that happen? What was going on? Was I distracted? Was I thinking of someone else? Was I looking at just one area of the board? What was my mindset? And you know, sometimes it helps me with my own thinking and that way I can prevent those types of mistakes in the future, almost like a metacognition thing, like thinking about your thinking. So to wrap this up, matteo, yeah, I think it's a great idea when you play online to use a physical board, not quite the same as actually doing it over the board, but in the meantime, like you said, because of your schedule, I think it's a great idea. Until such time that you can do it. And when you do play in your first over the board tournament, I wish you the best of luck. Let me know how it goes. Our next email is from Zach from Utah, so shout out to our listeners in Utah and he writes hi, neil, love the podcast. It's gotten me interested in playing OTB again. But all of the clubs in my area around Salt Lake City are informal and unrated, with most playing fast. For example, five minute Blitz time controls. Do you think playing in these kinds of clubs at these time controls is worthwhile. There are some tournaments hosted by the Utah Chess Association but even these are using faster time controls game 45 or less, sometimes even game five Blitz and is one four round, one day tournament a month enough to establish a rating and improve? I have found one weekly UCA that's Utah Chess Association game 15 four-round tournament hosted on Saturdays. But between playing at such a fast time control and playing four games back to back I'm unsure if it's good for OTB improvement. Thanks, zach, both for the nice words about the podcast and for your email. You raise some excellent questions and I do have a certain bias here because, as you know, if you've been listening to the podcast, I'm not a big fan of the whole like multiple games in one day thing. I'm really more of a once a week club person. I'm not saying that because I run a chess club, because even before I started the Long Island Chess Club that was kind of like how I felt I would go to these major weekend tournaments and I just was not doing well, I just couldn't play that much chess in one weekend. But let's kind of itemize or break down your message now, the first part of the email where you ask about playing five minute games in the informal club. I don't think it's worthwhile for improvement. Now listen, chess is supposed to be fun. If you're enjoying those five minute unrated tournaments, if you're enjoying it, if you find it worthwhile, then do it. Of course, if it's fun, do it. Is it going to really help you improve over the board? I don't think so. Long term, I mean it might help with tactics and things. Other people are going to disagree. Other people are going to say, yeah, play those five minute games. Any type of playing will help. I'm not so sure I agree with that. I mean, if you're looking to develop in classical time controls, I don't really know if that's the most beneficial way to spend your time, but if you're enjoying it, do it. Now you mentioned the rated tournaments hosted by the Utah Chess Association, right? Those Game 45s or less like those Game 30s. I'm not a big fan of those time controls. All right, because what happens is in a Game 45, you end up playing 40 minutes of slow chess and then you're blitzing out the last five minutes. It's basically who's going to make the blunder and lose the game. I'm not a big fan of those Game 45s, even the Game 60s, like the Game 30s. I'm not a big fan of those. I think for over the board time controls. The slowest I like to go is Game 90. Maybe Game 75, and that's with a minimum of a five-second delay. I'm not crazy about those. Now, to establish a rating, as soon as you play in even just one USCF rated tournament, even if it's just four games, you're going to get a provisional rating. All right, that's all you need to do there. Then I believe it's after 25 games I've been doing this. How long I should know this. I think it's after 25 games or something like that that you get a permanent rating. But up until that point it's a provisional rating and you're going to see it calibrate. It's going to make some crazy jumps like up down, up down as it calibrates. But yeah, as soon as you play in one rated tournament you're going to get a provisional rating. But I'm not crazy about those Game 45s. I think it's junk chess. Again, if you're enjoying it, do it If you're really looking to improve your classical game and really get strong and really up your rating. I don't think it's going to help long term. But again, you're also dealing with a situation where that's the only thing in your area. You have to think about that. It's a little bit of a trade-off. I've heard this before, zach, from many, many players where they want to play in USCF rated events. They want to play in slower time controls, but there's nothing OTB around them and if there is, it's these quick controls. So it puts you in a tough position. Do you not play at all because you hate that time control? Or do you do it because you really want to play but you don't like the time control? So you're going to have to weigh the pros and cons. I wish I had a better answer for you, but personally I'm not a big fan of those Game 45s. I would say this Try it out, okay, try it out, but I think long term you know those aren't the ideal time controls and hopefully there might be something in your area where they'll have maybe a game 90 or something slower, all right, but I wish you the best of luck. Our next message is from Chad. Good morning. I wanted to extend my compliments on the podcast. I've been enjoying it a lot. Over the last month I have recently been re-engaging with chess as we have been introducing our two sons to the game. It's been a lot of fun for the three of us to do the local chess club. However, as an adult, now in my mid 40s I've been finding my attempts at improvement to be a struggle. I don't have any delusions about being a tournament or rated player. I just like to sit down at the board or play a game online and not immediately be a doormat for my opponent. Your podcast, as well as your generally positive outlook, has been a big help for me. A fair amount of the content goes over my head, but I've gotten good advice and I think it helps to just get the language of chess in my head. I was wondering if you could recommend any books or annotated games or any books of annotated games, excuse me where the annotations are geared toward lower rated players. As much as I would be superficially drawn towards annotations written by Kasparov or Carlson or Fisher, without any common frame of reference, I think it would have very little educational value to me. It would be like learning to fly from an eagle. Anyway, thanks for what you do, have a great day and I hope you win your next game. Well, thank you, chad. The way I've been playing lately, I need all the help I can get. So I appreciate the good wishes. Anyway, thanks for the kind words, thanks for your email. A couple of things. As far as being an adult and struggling to get better, I feel you, I hear it. We're all dealing with that. Even adults of all levels of rating have that struggle. As we get older, we get busier. Most of our listeners are in a similar situation as you. Chad, I totally get it. Let me work backwards. I'm going to recommend the books that you requested and then I want to just talk about improvement at your level in general. The classic book as far as annotated games move by move, would be logical chess, move by move, move by Irving Chernev. I remember looking at it a while ago, but that's sort of a classic book you might want to check out. The other one which I read a number of years ago, which had a big impact on me, is Understanding Chess, move by Move by John Nunn. I'll link both of these up for you and anyone else who's interested. Now, that book, the Understanding Chess, move by Move I don't have it anymore. I read it a while ago. I don't know if I traded it to somebody or I don't know I was moving on. It got lost in the shuffle somehow, but I do remember it. That's a great one as well. Also, something else you might want to look into is the Starting Out series by Everyman Chess. Now, I've mentioned that before for openings. No matter what opening you use, whether it's the Roy Lopez or the Sicilian or the Lunt I'm just making up names off the top of my head but they have a Starting Out series for pretty much every opening. They also have Starting Out for different aspects of the game. But the Starting Out series by Everyman Chess it's not so much annotated games but regardless of which book it is, whether they're explaining like endings or an opening, they do a lot of annotations where they explain every move with a lot of written instructional prose. You may want to check that out. The Starting Out series by Everyman Chess that's another good book series. Also and I know people are going to start throwing things at me for saying this again I urge you to check out the Amateur's Mind by Jeremy Soman. Just from the tenor of your message I can kind of get a feel of where you're at. I really think that book is going to help. One general comment about annotated game collections even if they're geared for beginners. I think if someone I don't know exactly where you're at Chad, I think you're more than then like a ranked beginner. I think you know more than just how the pieces move. But, depending on where you're at, you may want to work on tactics and fundamentals and not hanging pieces, things like that, your basic checkmating patterns. You might want to work on that stuff first. Before you start getting into annotated game collections, even if they're geared for beginners, I think that might be a second or a third step. I don't think looking at annotated game books should be the first club out of the bag, so to speak. So, in other words, if you find yourself losing a lot of games because you're hanging pieces or you're missing mates in one or meet in two things like that I would focus more on just your general board vision and your tactics, and then the annotated games is something that you can add later on. Like I said, it's hard to really tell where you're at from your email, but I suspect that's something that you might want to look into. But, that being said, I wish you the best on your journey. I think the fact that you're playing with your sons and making it a family affair is awesome. I know I love it at the club when I see a dad come with the son or the daughter and they both get involved, or I've had moms come a few times. It's been a while since that happened, but it's always great to see when we have families come to the club. So what I think you're doing with your sons is fantastic. I hope those book recommendations help. That's not an exhaustive list or anything, but it's something to get you started and I wish you the best of luck on your journey. Our next message is from Chris from the UK, so shout out to our friends over there and he writes Hi, still loving the pod from across the pond, just wondering your take on how the world championships are run. I'm a firm believer that the format is useless. No other sport apart from combat sports sorts their champion like this, and finishing with Rapid or Blitz is horrendous. As with everything, there's no point having an opinion without a solution. Well, here's mine. Top seven players plus the current champion have a double round Robin. If players are tied, they play two 90 minute plus 30 second delays a day until there is a winner. The player who has the most wins in the round Robin starts as white. If that's the same, the player who has best head to head in the tournament starts as white. If that's the same, toss a coin and the highest rated player calls heads or tails, I can't imagine there won't be a winner within 6 90 minute plus 30 second delay games. Also a quick question regarding classical timed games. In top level games there are a lot of draws due to the deep theory which players can remember. What if players had 10 minutes for the first 10 moves, then go to a long time, such as 120 minutes for 40 moves, for example? I feel having a short time for 10 moves would encourage players to broaden their openings, but they wouldn't be able to go so deep, so an unusual opening could work. I've played games recently with 1 E3 and then 2 D4 into the Collier. Queens Gamble declined and that has confused people. Or 1 E3, 2 F4 Stonewall have helped. Thanks for the pod and the book recommendations. And yeah, we were just talking about this, the World Championship, in the previous episode with Gerald Times. We kind of had a nice back and forth about this. And yeah, I agree with you that the Blitz games, the rapid games for the tie breaks, has no place in a World Championship. It should be a classical time control. I think having those Blitz games, while they're certainly entertaining I mean I'm not going to lie to you, even for myself I think from an integrity standpoint that it shouldn't be in a World Championship. So we're in agreement there. Your round robin idea, your double round robin idea, is interesting. I don't know if that's going to fly with Fide. And then your suggestion about having a quicker time control in the beginning to force them to try different openings Interesting idea. Again, I don't know if that's going to fly with Fide. They're very set in their ways. We're going to see what happens. But I think there should be some type of format where it's all classical games and if the challenger doesn't like, if he doesn't win a certain amount of games, let's say, then the current champion would remain like something like that yeah, the chess World Championship. I mean we're definitely in agreement that the way it is now is not really ideal. I'm not a big fan of the format. So, chris, thank you for your email. Really appreciate it. Thanks for listening to the pod and best of luck to you. Our next message is from Shane High Neal great podcast. I have a problem as a beginner amateur, unrated. The problem I have is for Black to defend against one C4 and then to Queen A4. Can you give any advice please? All right, well, this is, of course, the English opening, and I've been seeing this a lot at the club, interestingly. So what I'm going to do, shane, let me talk about the English opening in general and then I'll address your specific concern, which is when White goes Queen A4. It's actually nothing to worry about, but here we go. So with one C4, white, essentially, is looking to control the D5 square. So usually what happens after C4? He'll follow up with Knight C3 and then he'll fiend Kendo on the King side with G2 G3 rather and then Bishop G2. So he's looking to control D5. Now the English opening is notorious for transposing into other openings. It can transpose into, like a Nymzo or a Queens Indian structure, into other standard D4 openings. It can transpose into a Catalan. So what I usually try to do is I try to steer it into a Nymzo or a Queens Indian, which is not too difficult to do, but that's the idea with the English opening. Now, after C4, my thing is to reply with one B6 and I'll fiend Kendo, my Queens Bishop to B7 right away, and then I'll probably follow with E6, bishop E7. I can get like a Queens Indian type thing, as I said, or in some cases I can do Bishop B4 and get a Nymzo going. You know, I try to transpose it into something I know, but there's a lot of different directions the English can go in. So to answer your question, shane, after one C4, okay, let's say Black plays something like Knight F6 or whatever it is, queen A4 as White's second move seems to bother you. Now I see what it is probably because you can't move the deep one, right, you'd like to do something like D5 or D6, but obviously it's pinned to the King from the Queen and it looks like kind of an annoying move. It's really nothing to worry about. Like you can just follow by playing Knight F6 and then you know maybe E6, bishop E7, castle Kingside. You could even follow to Queen A4 with like Knight C6, okay, and then you can then maybe move the deep pawn and then go Bishop D7. I mean something like that. It's not really anything to worry about. And then what's going to happen is, at some point you'll probably be able to attack as Queen while you develop. Again, I suspect the main thing that's annoying about Queen A4 when White plays that on a second move is that it pins your D7 pawn. But it's nothing to worry about. You can just kind of develop your King side first. Or, like I said, you can get in an early Knight C6. You can even play C5. And then knight c6 behind it and you'll have nice control over d4. Don't worry about the fact that you can't move the d pawn right away because, like I said, you have other options, all right. So just to recap, I'll just use knight f6 as black's first move as an example. After c4 and then something like knight f6, queen a4, you can go knight c6, right. You can go something like e6, all right. You could even do c5 and then knight c6 right away, you know, and then go e6 and then move your dark-squared bishop, that type of thing. But that queen is going to be a little vulnerable there on a4 because at some point you know you might be able to attack it. It's not really a good developing move. Now queen a4 is white's second move. It's probably good in like a speed game and like a 3-0 or a 5-0 blitz game. It's probably good because it might throw black off a little bit, but in a classical game it's nothing to worry about. So I hope that helps, shane. So just some ideas there on the English opening and good luck to you. Our final email is from Jackson. He writes good morning, afternoon or night. I have a question what are your thoughts and feelings on the Tennyson Gambit, the intercontinental ballistic missile variation? It's a meme opening and here is the YouTube link. Okay, thanks for your email, jackson. I have to admit when I first got this I thought it was spam or somebody playing a joke. But there is such a thing and what I'm going to do is refer everybody to a video that Levy Rosman put out on this. I'm going to link it below. I would recommend watching that. It's like a seven or eight minute video, but I'll discuss it briefly here Now. As far as my thoughts on it, I'm not an E4 guy, I'm not a Gambit guy and the thing with Gambits in general like for a Gambit for those of you who may not know who a beginner is a Gambit in the opening is essentially where you give up a pawn with the idea of getting a lead in development or maybe getting two center pawns, something like that. But you have to be comfortable playing those kinds of positions and playing aggressively and giving up a pawn. That's just not really my thing. So that's my own opinion, jackson, but it's certainly interesting. I wouldn't use it in a classical game, but the idea is that it's an offshoot of the Scandinavian defense. So after one E4, if black plays d5, you would play knight f3. And then it goes into this whole thing where you end up sacrificing another pawn. And then the reason it's called the intercontinental ballistic missile variation is because there's a tactic where you check black's king and then it forces your queen to take his queen. Or you know, black ends up losing his queen and your queen shoots across the board and takes his queen. That's why it's called the intercontinental ballistic missile variation. I never heard of this till you mentioned it, jackson, but I checked it out. It's entertaining, it's fun. You can try it. I mean, I think for online games it's probably a cool idea. If you're into aggressive E4 openings and you like doing gambits, check it out. What I'll do in the show notes I'll just put like the beginning moves and then, like I said, I'll link up Levy's video about this and you could check it out. Yeah, to answer your question, jackson. Yeah, you can have fun with it. I'm not going to use it at the club myself. Maybe I'll try it for fun on a five minute blitz game online. Like I said, though, I'm not really an E4 player, but it's certainly entertaining and I appreciate you bringing it to my attention, jackson. So that will do it for this week. I want to thank everybody who sent an email. They were great topics, great ideas. Again, if you have a topic idea for the show or a question for me, you can email me at info at thechessanglecom or message me on Twitter at the Chess Angle. I can't promise that your question or topic idea will be used, but I'll certainly look at everything that is sent my way. Really appreciate you listening and, as always, I hope you win your next game. Have a great day everyone.